Anti-Depressant vs. Anti-Anxiety?

[Rebecca]

Hi all --

How do you determine if an anti-anxiety med or anti-depressant is the best treatment? It would seem to me that if the GERD is triggered by anxiety than an anti-Anxiety med would be best, but some here have found relief from anti-depressant? How do you determine which one is best?

Also, to Pard and/or GW if you're reading this, what test will show if bile reflux is the problem?

Thanks so much,
Rebecca

[cpadpl]

Rebecca

Thanks so much for bringing this up, I was just discussing this with my friend today. I am recently new to this forum, but not new to heartburn. After careful analysis of my life (which I won't go into here), I have come to the conclusion that I believe my heartburn is the cause of both stress and diet.

As an example, I cut coffee and softdrinks out of my diet and went down from Nexium 20mg to Zantac 4 times a day, then 3 times a day. I recently took a break from work, and today am happy to report that I took nothing (except 3 precautionary Rolaids) and ate a nice big lunch with greasy fries, peanut butter and chocolate piece, 3 glasses of coke and 2 cups of coffee.

I have looked back on my life and realized that I am in a high pressure job (CPA) and internalize a majority of my anxiety. My heartburn seems to have increased as my stress level has increased. I am currently contemplating trying to address my anxiety problems (but how?) and was wondering if there any drugs (of course I'm anti-drug) to help.

[GW]

Rebecca,

Tests include endoscopic exam down the esophagus and/or a 24 hour Ph montor.

Anxiety causes excess bile to be fired off at times when it's not needed (like at night when you should be sleeping). An anti-anxiety med, such as Xanax, can prevent excess bile from shooting off into your stomach where it may in turn cause bloat, churning, and eventual expulsion up through the LES and into the esophagus.

One of the side effects of an antidepressant is anxiety. One of the side effects of an anti anxiety drug is depression. This is why, more often than not, doctors in the "know" will prescribe both to counteract and make life a little easier in the first few weeks.

It turns out, for me, that these two drugs together(taken at least two hours apart......please!) along with my Prilosec is what allowed the inflammation in my esophagus to heal.

I've been feeling fine for 10 months now and am off this med regimen and using natural supplements. I'm taking Green Magma® for my vitamins and using buttermilk, yogurt and Kefir® for the probiotic flora my digestive system needs.

Life is good again. :D

[robertw]

Thanks GW for the info about bile its the only thing that explains my condition.
I have suspected it for a long time

Did you find Xanax very addictive? That’s what I'm afraid of.
I easily get addictive to things.
I think that’s my problem: excess bile at night (it wakes me up every night)
I had the Fundo severals years ago didn't help, no more reflux but lots of bloat and pain
I occasionally have to take Elavil it helps allot and is non-habit forming
But I am hung over in the morning and sometimes most of the day
I was thinking Xanax might work better if it is bile.
I hate having to take this stuff, but I have no option if I want to get any sleep

[GW]

Originally posted by robertw


Did you find Xanax very addictive? That’s what I'm afraid of.


Atually, I also absolutely hated the idea of taking drugs. I take two Exedrin and I'm like "wired" for 2 hours straight!! (I know, I know......I'm a cheap date!;))

At any rate, the Xanax at that extremely low dosage (.25 mg) is NOT addictive. I never had to raise the dosage for the entire time I took it. It only took me about a week to wean off. In fact, I don't think I even "weaned" off of that amount, as I occasionally stopped the drug for days at a time and had no side effects from it at all!

Dr. Shipko's site has quite a bit of reasearched studies on the affects of Benzodiazapines as a CCK antagonist in the lower pyloric sphincter. (That's the problematic area where bile is produced......or, overproduced in my case)

Check out this chart that the study showed: http://www.algy.com/pdi/research.html

[robertw]

Thanks
I have a Xanax prescription 1 mg. I will chop into quarters and give it a try
I think this bile thing is not understood by most GI's at least not the 4 different ones I saw,
they said to just double up on the PPI's
If my stomach is empty its much worse.
I have a very odd problem and it only happens at night about 2 hours after going to sleep
The only thing that gives me any relief from bloating and painful sore stomach is if I eat fish and chips for lunch (greasy)
I wish I knew why, what I notice is the amount of rectal gas goes up about 10 fold (Flatulence) and that might give some relief from
The bloating. Does that make sense?

[GW]

<<"Does that make sense?">>


That would be an affirmative Robert. There has been studies that show that eating food high in protein can relieve the kind of symptoms you're speaking of. In fact, Dr. Wallach (the "Dead Doctors Don't Lie" guy)*, suggests eating a "slab of fish, broiled chicken, steak, or a hunk of cheese" a couple of hours before bedtime can ease the pain of ulcerated digestive tracts. Now, grant it, this will absolutely fly in the face of anyone having severe GERD or "esophagitis", as an empty stomach is recommended for most patients. However, I found that after my inflammation healed the only negative thing happening was the gas bloat and eating a hunk of the "Good Vet's" menu really helped alot.

*Note* Those who read here that I mention Dr. Wallach, PLEASE, don't jump to conclusions that this was the only guy I researched for my problems. And though I do subscribe to his regime of good nutritional supplements, I don't order his products or sell them. I get my own at health food stores and I "Juice" for my vitamins. Again, this was just one of a hundred sources I exhausted in the years I was suffering. Thanks for your consideration.

Your Faithful Servant,

geeDub

[af]

Originally posted by robertw
Thanks
I have a Xanax prescription 1 mg. I will chop into quarters and give it a try
I think this bile thing is not understood by most GI's at least not the 4 different ones I saw,
they said to just double up on the PPI's
If my stomach is empty its much worse.
I have a very odd problem and it only happens at night about 2 hours after going to sleep
The only thing that gives me any relief from bloating and painful sore stomach is if I eat fish and chips for lunch (greasy)
I wish I knew why, what I notice is the amount of rectal gas goes up about 10 fold (Flatulence) and that might give some relief from
The bloating. Does that make sense?


It is hard to say if this fits your situation, as it sounds like you get RELIEF from fatty foods, where I get PROBLEMS from them.

I feel for you. I think I have bile reflux as a complicating factor. Dr. Burton told me to stay on a low-fat diet, eating no more than 15 grams of fat at any meal. Today I was on the road and starving, having not eaten all day, so at 3:30 p.m. while on the way home (having to eat and drive at the same time, and not many choices at this little town), I got a 7-layer burrito at Taco Bell. Well, it went down fine, it has no hot sauce on it. I took my zantac. Everything's fine for about 30 mins, and then all of a sudden "whoosh"--I feel my stomach empty suddenly. Gut starts to cramp with sharp pains down low. I didn't have the diarrhea until i got home, but then ....well, you get my drift ;) (and be glad you weren't here to get my drift..haha)

At home I usually have a "healthy choice" frozen dinner or something else low fat and everything is fine, but eating on the road is very hard when you don't have time to stop, at least it is for me.

But you might wanna give the xanax a try and see if it helps. If it does, you should know pretty fast, from what I have read of others' experiences.

[robertw]

The times that I have eaten the most like Christmas and Thanksgiving dinner were you go back for seconds and even thirds and then desserts and the rest, that’s the only time I got total relief.
I had to find all this out by trial and error so it took me several years to figure out what was happening
I used to think if I didn't eat anything it would help but its the opposite for me.
Sometimes when I had stomach pain I would take zantac
and never understood why it made it worse, I think it’s because
of the bile sometimes being non acidic.
Most people do get PROBLEMS from fatty foods and I thought I would
this is why I think Gerds is so hard to cure its so varied
I had to diagnose it myself
4 different doctor (G I) sent me
for the motility and ph test and endoscopes had it 4 times each came back normal. They said the wrap is tight there’s no problem
that didn't help me getting only a few hours sleep every night

[GW]

Originally posted by robertw

..........
I used to think if I didn't eat anything it would help but its the opposite for me.
.........
Most people do get PROBLEMS from fatty foods and I thought I would
.........
They said the wrap is tight there’s no problem
that didn't help me getting only a few hours sleep every night

Dude! I think that you're just HUNGRY, man! :D Your tumTum is looking for stuff to digest and it's going for your organs and tissues man!

Seriously, give the anti-anxiety/anti acid thing a try for awhile. Can't hurt. See what happens. You calm down the night reflux thing with the "CCK thermostat" I call Xanax and it may be the end of your problems.


(ooops! Did I just "diagnose" you?! :rolleyes: )

[robertw]

Thanks GW pretty sure you did just diagnose me
Its what I somehow suspected for a long time, the normal regimen of Gerds meds didn't work for me, in fact made it worse
Last night I just took a small dose of elavil and got some sleep
I will try Xanax on the weekend when I don’t have to work so much, my job I have to put out 110 % when I am only functioning at 10 % with little sleep, so I don’t want to try anything new ,it might take awhile to kick in
I think Elavil does a similar job as Xanax but xanax will work better since it works directly on the CCK.
I think if you can pinpoint something your 3/4 ways there
I feel so relieved already like lifting a 100 kg weight of me
Ands this is what its all about stress and anxiety
I printed out that diagram from DR.Shpko very interesting

Thanks again

[GW]

Originally posted by robertw
T........
Last night I just took a small dose of elavil and got some sleep
I will try Xanax on the weekend when I don’t have to work so much,
..........

Just be sure, Robert, you check with your Pharmacist or the local Poison Control Board to see if there are any "interactions" with the Elavil. I think I know, but won't tell you what was told to me.........OK?

Take Care buddy!

G

[robertw]

Tyanks GW
Where you just a night time sufferer or did you have problems during the day?

[GW]

Daytime as well. :( Chest pains, tingling limbs, dizziness, nausea, regurgitation, etc., etc.







.......evil, evil days. Five solid years.........:rolleyes: