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I think ppi's are actually causing/aggravating my LPR - anyone else have this?

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  • I think ppi's are actually causing/aggravating my LPR - anyone else have this?

    I've been suffering with LPR for a little over 3 years. Prior to this time I had what I would call "normal heartburn" in that I would have just heartburn (no LPR symptoms) that would go away completely with just one over the counter Prilosec.

    After a while I was taking Prilosec every day and also eating poorly (lots of incredibly spicy food, wine/beer, overeating, strong coffee on an empty stomach, etc - thought the Prilosec made me invincible - HA!) when one day in the spring on 2007 I had a massive spasm in my Larnyx right in the middle of eating a habanero slathered burrito. I've had LPR symptoms (hoarse voice, constant throat clearing, sore throat, and occasional coughing) plus occasional burning stomach ever since and life has not been the same.

    I saw my family doctor then an ENT and finally a gastroenterologist who put me on Previcid (30 mg) 2X per day. I also dramatically changed my eating habits (zero caffeine, no spicy food, small meals, etc) lost 30 lbs (I am now quite thin). I was still miserable and the first thing I noticed is that I felt better if I cut my PPI from 2X to 1X per day. Then I cut it to 30 mg every other day and felt even better! However, when I tried to quit completely I would feel great in the first day or two (my LPR symptoms would almost go away!) then feel like crap (almost like a had a mild flu) then the intense buring stomach would kick in. I'm assuming this is "PPI rebound"?

    My question is - could my PPI actually be causing my LPR symptoms? I have been on some sort of PPI for probably 5 or 6 years. My gastro dr seems to think this is nonsense. However, to me it's as if the PPIs are reducing my acid as they should (stomach feels OK most of the time and there is no heartburn) but the regurgitation in my throat/lungs seems to be much worse.

    When I quit the PPI the reverse happens - my throat/lungs feel much better but my stomach burns and I start feeling heartburn again.

    I'm not sure what to do - I'm not sure what the "real me" is like. I know that on PPIs it's definitely not the "real me" but off may not be either since I may be getting rebound. I could try to taper but I'm afraid I will still get rebound and be back to where I was 3 years ago.

    Any advice is greatly appreciated!

    jim

  • #2
    I think the PPIs make me bloated, which gives me LPR, so yes I think you're right. It's a horrible vicious circle if you ask me.

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    • #3
      Kapidex (Dexilant), makes me feel bloated and nervous. It also keeps certain vitamins and minerals from being absorbed in my tummy, but if I try to stop taking it, the mucus build up in my throat becomes unbearable, and the swelling and redness returns(currently dealing with that).

      So now I'm being treated for vitamin deficiencies caused by the medication, and LPR!

      Comment


      • #4
        Not in my case

        I've never experienced heartburn it's only been LPR. I've been taking PPI twice daily for 6 months now and I've followed a strict diet (lost 35 pounds). My symptoms have improved but they are still there and I'm afraid that they will get worse if I stop taking the PPIs. I'm even considering having the Nilssen, but doctors say I need a PH impedance test.

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        • #5
          I cannot tolerate the side effects (and there are lots of them) of PPI's. I switched to an all natural regimen that helped me tremendously:
          [url]http://forums.heartburn-help.com/showthread.php?t=7527&highlight=all-natural[/url]

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          • #6
            I've had the Nissen's. I've been very disappointed as I've had no improvement whatsoever. In fact I think the surgery has made things worse. I'm now plagued by spasms which seem to suck up yet more acid.

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            • #7
              Thanks NYer - I also got another interesting diet from a local pharmacist (see below)

              interesting...

              I was at my local pharmacy yesterday and was getting a refill of Protonix at a lower dose when I mentioned that I have severe GERD. I've never had this happen before where a Pharmacist took such an interest. Her diet which she claimed would work in 40 days was:

              1) Eat Kiwi fruit for brakfast along with Zinc tablets

              2) Cabbage for lunch (she emphsized cabbage in general)

              3) Whey protein (can get this in powered form in a health food store) along with dinner

              4) If you have to use an antacid use only Gaviscon or something similar (stay away from calcium-based antacids).

              I have no idea what how/why any of these things work! There you go...

              Originally posted by NYer View Post
              I cannot tolerate the side effects (and there are lots of them) of PPI's. I switched to an all natural regimen that helped me tremendously:
              [url]http://forums.heartburn-help.com/showthread.php?t=7527&highlight=all-natural[/url]

              Comment


              • #8
                Well, cabbage IS good. I have no idea why she is recommending Kiwi. If you take zinc, don't take it on an empty stomach. And the type of zinc you want to take is zinc carnosine. Whey protein is good for you but I don't know what her reasoning is for GERD, but it won't hurt and it could help other things.

                If you take Gaviscon, order it from Canada. Don't take American Gaviscon. It contains aluminum (Canadian does not) and it doesn't taste as good as the Canadian either.

                Please keep us updated on if this all works.

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                • #9
                  i would go back and ask what each one does.

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                  • #10
                    Kiwi fruit contains proteolytic enzymes much like pineapple and papaya and I think thats why she suggested it

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                    • #11
                      OK, so that still doesn't answer the question. I find pineapple to be a trigger for my GERD. Papaya doesn't bother me. I am leery of kiwi because of the similarity to pineapple, so I don't eat them. Papaya enzyme is sometimes used as a digestive enzyme, however you'd have to eat a LOT of papaya to accomplish that. And a kiwi is even smaller than a papaya. And they don't use kiwi as a digestive enzyme. So, again, the question is, why is she telling him to eat kiwi? And why for breakfast? And what is the whey protein supposed to do? And why at dinner? And guaranteed to work in 40 days? Why?

                      A lot of people have a lot of ideas that sound great because they involve healty/natural products. But not everyone has a clue of what they're talking about. I had a chiropractor who made all kinds of suggestions and sold me all kinds of powder mixes for special healthy shakes - and sold me zinc (but not the right kind for GERD) - and sold me licorice powder. He claimed this stuff helped him. Well, the powder for the shake had all kinds of healthy stuff in it. But it gave me NASTY Heartburn. And I now know that the Licorice powder mixed with water would certainly have benefits for GERD, but it should be DGL licorice - not plain licorice, which can raise your blood pressure and other related side effects. So lots of people have good intentions but are wrong in the implementation - even people in health professions.

                      I would LOVE to know the reasoning behind these suggestions and and if they have any validity, I'd love to try them. It sounds like she's on the right track but I am not sure that the way she suggests to take these things, the timing, or the overall choices have much soundness.

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        I believe it was the glutamine that she was after and that some of these powered...

                        whey protein mixes have that in there. So I have read on these boards that l-Glutamine is suppose to be good. As far as kiwi fruit goes I don't know what is so special about that maybe the digestive enzymes. I also have issues with anything too acidic especially in the morning so I am not too excited about trying that. I asked her where she got this recipe from and said it was part of a nutritional seminar that she took aimed at folks who are invloved in medicine such as pharmacists, nurses, GPs, etc. Next time I see her I'll ask about it in more detail.

                        Frankly, I'd rather try NYer's natural diet before this one since it's not clear where all of the suggestions fit in.


                        Originally posted by NYer View Post
                        OK, so that still doesn't answer the question. I find pineapple to be a trigger for my GERD. Papaya doesn't bother me. I am leery of kiwi because of the similarity to pineapple, so I don't eat them. Papaya enzyme is sometimes used as a digestive enzyme, however you'd have to eat a LOT of papaya to accomplish that. And a kiwi is even smaller than a papaya. And they don't use kiwi as a digestive enzyme. So, again, the question is, why is she telling him to eat kiwi? And why for breakfast? And what is the whey protein supposed to do? And why at dinner? And guaranteed to work in 40 days? Why?

                        A lot of people have a lot of ideas that sound great because they involve healty/natural products. But not everyone has a clue of what they're talking about. I had a chiropractor who made all kinds of suggestions and sold me all kinds of powder mixes for special healthy shakes - and sold me zinc (but not the right kind for GERD) - and sold me licorice powder. He claimed this stuff helped him. Well, the powder for the shake had all kinds of healthy stuff in it. But it gave me NASTY Heartburn. And I now know that the Licorice powder mixed with water would certainly have benefits for GERD, but it should be DGL licorice - not plain licorice, which can raise your blood pressure and other related side effects. So lots of people have good intentions but are wrong in the implementation - even people in health professions.

                        I would LOVE to know the reasoning behind these suggestions and and if they have any validity, I'd love to try them. It sounds like she's on the right track but I am not sure that the way she suggests to take these things, the timing, or the overall choices have much soundness.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          BY the way, what is zinc carnosine suppose to do?

                          Nt sure I have heard of zinc anything before this.

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                          • #14
                            Zinc carnosine is a combination of zinc and the amino peptide L-carnosine. Supposely, the L-carnosine provides protection the stomach by strengthening the mucosal layer in the stomach. And this combination is suppsed to be able to withstand stomach juices, so it can do its job. I've taken it for a long time. I have no idea if it helps or not.

                            Nt sure I have heard of zinc anything before this.
                            You haven't heard of zinc? It's a mineral. A metal. And your body requires a small amount of it to function.

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                            • #15
                              I believe it was the glutamine that she was after and that some of these powered whey proteins...
                              Yes, that would be logical. But I take L-Glutamine directly three times daily - don't need to take it as part of something else. And why say to take it with dinner? You want to take it over the course of the day.

                              So, basically, it sounds like she's well-meaning and has a little bit of knowledge but doesn't know anything more than that. The substance of what she's saying may be good, but you need the details and the how-to's when you take these things and there are ways to do them correctly that help and there are ways that don't necessarily harm you but they don't help.

                              And the "you'll be fine in 40 days" thing is just nonsense. No one can make a statement like that.

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